Ok I found this genius comic, thenoobcomic. This is one of my favorite parts. I woudlnt' post a image this big for fear of it being deleted but I think this post is worth it.
This comic applies to all people who have played MMORPGS. If you've played one i guarantee you'll get some laughs out of this. Its the world of Clichequest, pretty much a satire of bad mmos, meaning most mmos.
THE NEWBIE STARTING AREA
http://www.thenoobcomic.com/images/20040730.jpg
Start here if you want to read the whole thinghttp://www.thenoobcomic.com/daily/strip001.html
Sykoi
03-12-2006, 02:52 PM
Great comic, in fact we used to advertise on their site and I wouldn't doubt it if we did again :D
(Read the Next few comics from that point, especially the one about the rat father :haha:)
selmo
03-12-2006, 02:55 PM
Hahahaha, sooo true!!! I hate grinding...and newb grinding is the worst!!
kyohisakawa
03-12-2006, 04:00 PM
Oh god... The Trial of the Island! I hated that in EQ2... why would they force you to stay on an island (though a pretty island!) until level 6? Killing Goblins just lost it's cool factor the 10000000000000th time you killed one.
I don't think I've played an MMO without a newbie training zone.
Spike
03-12-2006, 04:17 PM
A necessary evil I suppose. T:Law will need some sort of newbie starting area.
Sykoi
03-12-2006, 04:22 PM
Why would we need a newbie starting area, Spike? ;)
selmo
03-12-2006, 04:56 PM
Yeah there really are no levels...so all the monsters are the same..I have always wondered where you would start out in T:law, would it be the capital random, or do u choose from major cities?
Sykoi
03-12-2006, 04:58 PM
...Monsters?
Spike
03-12-2006, 05:05 PM
Umm..selmo I would have never thought you would ask a question like a monsters lvl...
Ok, well thats good Sykoi if your figuring a way out so there is no newb starting area but players are going to need a tutorial of some sort. Plus I have no idea how you are balancing this game it looks very tricky. Unless you just have all these mobs of humans that serve like "monsters" for quests and such.
Sykoi
03-12-2006, 05:16 PM
...You really don't understand Tatsumaki, do you?
1) There are no monsters
2) There is no grinding
3) There are no levels
4) Quests involve logical, unique tasks - not "kill 10 monsters", but more like "spy on an enemy fortress" or, for a much longer quest, "Find person x to learn their secrets" (Tradeskill, combat, etc.)
5) Theres nothing to balance. Theres no forced aspect of the game, combat will be twitch based with more and more complex combos as they get more involving. (I.e., a simple high kick would be to look up and kick, a more complex move may require you to punch, kick, block, move the mouse into the correct positions for each move AND move around to result in an equal force as the amount of force went into it - similar to real life. The more power that goes into something is the more power that goes out)
6) Quests, missions, etc. that involve killing will, on most cases, also involve actual players - anyone that is a part of a faction you're attempting to take out, who believe in something different, or just the enemies of someone who gave the quest.
7) Character creation / Tutorial (http://www.tatsumaki-online.com/wiki/index.php/Character_Creation)
To the best of my knowledge, all of this is in the wiki... Somewhere, if its not - I apologize... It will have to be one of the many things DeXtrose and I work on when we have time.
Spike
03-12-2006, 05:22 PM
Thanks for the answer, but I do understand that concept of no monsters, no lvling, and a twitch based system and it makes my jaws drop just thinking about it. By 'Balance' issues I meant how you would one get their attributes up if they did not quest. So i was thinking you have people replace monsters with different "skill" lvls. Giving you more Attribute points in perhaps different kinds of combat. Such as archery, knives, swords, spears.
Oh and your explanation you provided helps me to understand more than the wiki tells us.:D
-sidenote Quests, missions, etc. that involve killing will, on most cases,
also involve actual players -
anyone that is a part of a faction you're attempting to take out, who believe in something different, or just the enemies of someone who gave the quest.
In that case of involving actual players to take out. Then will it be possible for Family leaders to issue these kinds of quests but the quest will have different preset rewards perhaps.
Hige Katsumori
03-12-2006, 05:25 PM
Sighs
This game will be absolutely beautiful...
Oh, and Sykoi, if you're still lurking about here, I think that when I get a job, I'm going to sign up for the 3 year alpha =D You guys probably need the money, and I know I need this game. So, we both win.
Sykoi
03-12-2006, 05:57 PM
First off, spike, there are no 'attribute' points... I believe the wiki explains this, if not - search the forums. Although I will try my best to explain it here, if you're too lazy :p
Basically everyone has the same maximum amount of attribute 'points', however they can not and will not ever see these - instead they will be represented on a graph. As in real life, doing certain actions will increase and/or decrease certain attributes, or a group of attributes. Such as cutting timber would increase strength, and dexterity by a small amount. Picking locks would decrease strength and increase dexterity and agility (Keep in mind we have yet to name these attributes and I'm just using these names for the sake of simplicity).
This way the game is always in balance - players who dedicate themselves to combat will become extremely powerful against someone who dedicated themselves to alchemy, and someone who's a 'bard' of sorts (Master of all) will only be 'standard' at all skills at best.
This also leads me to explain the fact that the skill system in Tatsumaki will be non-existent in a way, at least not existing in the standard sense. Rather than having a list of your skills, the number value, etc. - there will be a list of what you have learned on your own and in class/dojo, in a somewhat unique 'journal' of sorts.
This isn't to say that getting better armor, weapons, tradeskill gear, housing, etc. won't offer a reward - on the contrary, it will... Armor and weapons will be laid out in a logical manner that offers greater armor strength against stress with the use of certain metals, while possibly impairing the other aspects. The wiki DOES have more information on this, so you may look at the item system (I believe) for more information.
And yes, since we allow players to create their own NPCs - they could, technically, create their own quests... This is something we'll be attempting to add in the later stages of development, though.
Hige: Good to hear :)
kyohisakawa
03-12-2006, 06:14 PM
Good man, Hige, good man! I wish I could afford to buy that, and I totally would if I could!
I sometimes find myself wondering if the kill player missions would be fun or not. Though, I think if I got one, I'd try not to be a jerk about it, and request a duel!... because no one wants to be killed while chopping down a tree or... knitting a sweater.
Spike
03-12-2006, 06:20 PM
Armor and weapons will be laid out in a logical manner that offers greater armor strength against stress with the use of certain metals, while possibly impairing the other aspects.
I have read it, in fact i've read over all the articles and then some. I guess I don't get my points across very well and am misunderstood. but besides that I did not say I misunderstood the gear affecting your "stats", in fact I understand that part pretty clearly I think, but the attributes part of the wiki is not fully explained in my opinion.
Such as cutting timber would increase strength, and dexterity by a small amount.
That is not there in the wiki.
And what I meant by "your answer explaining "more" than the wiki provides" is that you explain some things that are not in the wiki. I do not mean you provide more info than the wiki, I just mean you provide details and such that you stated that help me to understand more.
This is great stuff you are sayin that should be in the wiki.
:You_Rock: Sykoi
Telsist
03-12-2006, 07:18 PM
Awkward, I thought I'd read through all of the wiki, but I did not see the section on the Tutorial.
kyohisakawa
03-12-2006, 07:20 PM
I think I remember reading it when I joined, Telsist... it may have been added recently, but don't quote me on that.
selmo
03-12-2006, 07:50 PM
Awkward, I thought I'd read through all of the wiki, but I did not see the section on the Tutorial.
It was added pretty recently to the best of my knowlege, of course almost all MMOs have tutorials which should be fun, seems to start you with some interestin stuff to
Sykoi
03-12-2006, 07:54 PM
The wiki hasn't been updated for over three months, but yes, with that in mind - it is a new addition :D
kyohisakawa
03-12-2006, 08:20 PM
Yeah the tutorial sounds pretty cool. I suppose the "Noob Training Ground" would be the tutorial.
Raku
03-13-2006, 01:01 AM
Ok... selmo really surprised me with that question lol.
But anyway back to the topic: (The comic)
So funny, yet so true...
kyohisakawa
03-13-2006, 02:00 AM
My favorite line from it was "Train to zone!". Reminds me of good old Ragnarok in Geffen Dungeon... a high level would come in and pull a massive army of MOBs to the zone. They'd exit the zone and GASP! Monsters everywhere that no one can kill! Bats, Moths, and POISON MUSHROOMS! Arghhh!!!
That's why I really love games with seamless zones. I hate having a big pile up of creatures when someone is too weak to kill them all.
One guy in WoW took a really strong monster across like 20 zones and put it in the main castle in the human city because it never stopped chasing him. It was great fun to see the king's guard beating up on it, and dying!
Letum
08-02-2007, 03:34 PM
yup, the comic was gd laff *gigglz* :P
i got sudden urge of playing WoW again ^^'
btw i'm not trying to get posts from old topics, just thought other ppl who have joined after this topic has gone stealth would like to read the comix too..
Zorbon
08-02-2007, 03:48 PM
hum, letum, this thread is almost 2 years old :confused:
Letum
08-02-2007, 04:20 PM
but the comic is still going and they are makeing new pages as we speak (probably not as we speak)
if u wonder how i found this.. well i was searching for something, cant remember what and found this, also found the comic to be funny and entertaining.. and thought i would post.. now i have posted twice in this.. this looks bad for me :crying: :crying:
(and the last post before mine was posted at year 2006 so i thought it wouldnt be so outrageous if i would post mine now 1 year later.. i saw some other guy post to a samurai thread where there was last post aswell on year 2006, if u r wondering though my "posting spree" then thats because i am uberly bored, even of WoW, m&b got boring too after playing 48 hours str8 with few short breaks.. all other games feel so boring aswell)
i just noticed i have last posts in 4 sections so i'm gonna go ninja for while, learn to play football or something..